Woodworking Business

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Vertical Panel Saw Cutting

1/29/21       
Puzzleman Member

I use 1" laminated multi ply sheets cut to 9-1/4 x 11-3/4 pieces. Currently using about 6-8 sheets per week.

I am currently having my supplier cut the sheets to size for me for a charge of $45 for each order. I have found another supplier of the exact same product for $59.00 per sheet cheaper. However, this supplier can't cut to size. So I am looking into vertical panel saws to cut.

Questions: Is this the best cutting operation option for me? If so. what brands do you suggest? What are the points I should look for in buying a used? There are 2 for sale on this site. #1. Putsch Meniconi brand; #2 Holz Her 1265. Opinions?

1/29/21       #2: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
chuckc

The Holz Her 1265 looks like a good deal. I had one exactly like it that I bought used and used it for about ten years until I replaced it with a cnc. Worked great for cross cutting.

1/29/21       #3: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
cabinetmaker

The saw will give good versatile use for other work.

But look beyond that and realize that it would be set up, sharpening etc before the delivered product is in your hands.

If you are passing the cost on, keep passing it on

1/30/21       #4: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Karl E Brogger

My opinion, the only vertical panel saw worth owning is a Streibig. If you don't have a use for one other than this one thing, maybe not worth the investment? I don't know what they cost now, but mine is 10 years old, and I think it was $27k?

$59/sheet, seven times a week is $21,476. Call it a two year roi because you'll have to either pay somebody to run it, or do it personally. That's not terrible. I've done a lot more for a lot less.

I do love my panel saw. I'd be a lot less further along without it.

1/30/21       #5: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
TonyF

Puzzleman:

For years I have been cutting pieces needing to be clean both sides on my Unisaw. I have folding outfeed and side tables attached, so full sheets have never been a problem.

I make a blank zero clearance insert out of Baltic birch, and use an alternate bevel blade. I run the blade up through the insert. I make a cut with the blade at about 1/4" blade height, raise the blade high enough to cut through the material, and run the same cut through again. A poor man's self-scoring blade table saw, although a little more time consuming.

For me, this has worked for everything from melamine to walnut burl veneer, and allows you to use existing equipment.

Your managing to lower the material costs are remarkable, and unless you truly want to finance a panel saw with your savings, you might try another method first.

If my continued sales or usage of these pieces is guaranteed for a few years, or increases, I might consider the purchase. If you really don't need a panel saw for anything else, there are probably other things that you could do with the money.

Eight sheets a week is not that much cutting, and you even might consider subbing it out if you had other things to do. You could make arrangements for your new supplier to drop ship it to your sub.

Good luck with whatever you decide.
TonyF

2/1/21       #6: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Oggie Member

Your new savings would allow you to easily finance any saw you want, maybe even a CNC.
Now, you didn't give much details about anything else regarding this work (i.e. how precise your cuts need to be, chipping or no chipping on the back, do you edgeband those pieces etc.) or about your other operations.
I've been cutting cabinet parts on a cabinet saw for 2 years before I got a slider, and since your parts are all the same, a simple cabinet saw with a few jigs could also do the work.
If you could use some more capable machine for some other things in your shop, maybe it would be better to go for that one.

Anyway, make sure that $59 lower price will be there long enough for those savings to work.
In my area things disappear overnight, sheet materials come from Canada one week, next week from Columbia, third week from Vietnam and so on, color/shades/thickness/prices seem to be a random variable and nobody knows if the material I buy this week will be available next week or even ever again. I hope you're in a more predictable environment.

2/8/21       #7: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Puzzleman Member

Thank you for your feedback.
When I bring the cutting in house, I will not be lowering my pricing. My customers are good with it as it is now.

I am looking at a new one versus a used one. Have found a couple of used ones locally so I will be looking into those. New ones look great but the price is higher. But then again, I can get it financed at a reasonable cost.

Thanks for your help.

2/8/21       #8: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Scott

How much space do you have? If you have space I would buy a used sliding table saw, I see them for sale all over the place, a lot of them are SCM, they make a great saw. You could cut what you need in no time, beautifully I might add. The rest of the time the saw could be used for many other things, I have owned both the sliding saw and the vertical saw and I think the sliding saw can be used for a lot more things. Just my 2 cents.

2/8/21       #9: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Puzzleman Member

Space is a big limitation. Shop part is only 1200 sq ft. Have 8 ft spray booth and 2 4x8 cncs as well as pallet rack and production sanders and such for building.

2/8/21       #10: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Karl E Brogger  Member

Website: http://www.sogncabinets.com

Slow, but unless you absolutely can't spare the cnc time, I'd just cut them on the cnc.

2/8/21       #11: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Scott

I am just curious what you use your 2 cnc’s for, wouldn’t take long to cut these parts on a cnc.

2/9/21       #12: Vertical Panel Saw Cutting ...
Puzzleman Member

I make puzzle stools and toy boxes. Step Stools with the name puzzled into the top. Toy Boxes with name personalized into the front by inlay.

I work on a retail calendar in that 50% of my business is from November to January. During that time I keep both machines running the whole day. One is just for cutting the letters for the step stools and toy boxes. The other cuts the frames for the step stools, parts for the styles of stools, parts for the toy boxes and carving out for the inlay in the front of the toy boxes. During the holiday season, I have no time left on the machines for anything else. We run 10 hour days 6 days a week for all of November and December.

Used to cut the blanks on the cnc in the past. Was not able to cut the 5x5 sheets of baltic birch for the stool backs on the cnc as they are too big. So I had my supplier cut them to size for me. Then had them cut the fronts for me as well and it improved my flow as we were able to process more stools during each day. I realized that my customers pay me to do the personalization in the stool and toy box, not cutting wood into squares.

Was happy with the situation, until the manufacturer extended the lead time without telling anyone. That's when I started scrambling for my particular type of wood. That's when I found that I could save $59 per sheet. Use about 200+ sheets per year, so that $12,000 in a year. Cutting fee is $45 per setup so that works out to $180 per week and that works out to $9,000+ in a year. That is $21,000 in cash flow. By using a panel saw, I can maintain current product flow by having an non-cnc person cut the pieces to size.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Sponsors
    • TradeJobPlacement.com
      Individualized Placement Services, Specializing in Millwork Design Engineers
    • OMEC/Macoser Inc
      Exclusive Importer of European Woodworking Machinery Since 1988
    • Vexor Custom Woodworking Tools, Inc.
      Custom and Standard Router Bits, Shaper Cutters, Profile Knives, Multi Profile Insert Tooling and More
    • Cabinetshop Maestro
      Web-Based Project Management Software for Custom Cabinet Shops - Manage Jobs from Prospect to Punchlist Through Scheduling, Task Management, Time Tracking and Communication
    • NEMI
      Products For CNC Machines - Digitizers, Tool Setters, Vacuum Pods, Vacuum Cups, Vacuum Tables, Vacuum Chucks and Software
    • Air Handling Systems
      Your Best Source for Dust and Fume Collection
    • WoodJobs.com Search Consultants
      Free Employment Service for Woodworking Related Job Seekers
    • TradeSoft
      Seamless Management Software to Improve Estimating, Job Costing, Scheduling, Purchasing, Shipping, and Shop Floor Data Collection
    • Impact Search and Placement
      Professional Employment Recruiting Specialists
    • Rangate
      Woodworking Machinery, Supplies and Knowledge
    • Parts Cutter CNC
      CNC Cabinetry and Closet Parts
    • Better Vacuum Cups, Inc.
      Vacuum Cups for All CNC Routers As Well As Many After Market Parts for Your CNC
    • ULTI-BOARD
      The Ultimate Spoilboard - ULTI-BOARD - Specifically Engineered and Formulated for the Ultimate in Spoilboard Performance - Not Your Ordinary Sheet of MDF.

    Become a Sponsor today!