Safety Speed Cut Thermwood Corporation ECabinet Systems

Cabinetmaking

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Need reliable source for hardware

2/3/21       
Oggie Member

As a vital part of my grandiose plan I need to incorporate drawer box production in my shop based on a metal box drawer systems, like Blum Metabox or Grass Zargen/Integra or whatever else in similar price and quality range.

However, I have - or at least I think I have - some problems finding reliable source of those. I've spend whole week shopping around, but without much success.

Some retailers carry some of those in their brick & mortar shops that are in another city but for some reason!? not in shops in my area.
Some online shops seem to have those in abundance but shipping costs are ridiculous (like $200 for shipping for a $400 of merchandise).
Other that have reasonable shipping costs have just a few on stock, and need to contact whomever to find out if and when the amount I need will be available.
Then some seem to have enough items on stock and reasonable costs of shipping, but the prices of items is two- or threefold of what others ask.

Employees I can reach over the phone, or in person in case of local shops, mostly have no clue about anything.

Is this how it usually is? Am I expecting too much?

I'm not sure if this forum's marketing policies allow to openly suggest places to shop for goods and services, but if not please, if you have any suggestions, send them to me in private message, if it's not allowed here.

Thank you,
O.

2/3/21       #2: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Jim Herron

I don't know your situation.
I briefly tried a couple of drawer box systems with same results
I got pushback on the Zargens, which frankly are kind of low end feeling and I tried the Legrabox.
In my area the wood dovetail box is the benchmark.
Neither stocked enough inventory and I can offer 1/2" Baltic birch sides for builder to mid grade and hardwood in any number of species to the higher end...with either sitting on Blum Tandem slides for the same or less money than the Zargen, Metabox or Legrabox.
I don't have to stock endless heights, lengths, rails, press fittings or boring and pressing machines...or wait for backordered inventory.
Most customers accept the dovetailed Baltic birch without question.
The higher end customers want the drawer boxes to match the cabinet- maple, white oak, sapele, african mahogany, walnut, ect.
I machined them on a manual Brookman for years (for sale btw) and my volume finally requires a Dodds SE20 automatic.
PM for more info.

2/3/21       #4: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Sean Reynolds Member

Oggie,
Not sure of your location.
We use HDL out of Minnesota, they carry a full line of Legrabox hardware, its a bit tricky ordering all the components, but my Blum rep says they will be offering drawer kits coming this year.

2/4/21       #5: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Scott Markwood

Talk with your Häfele rep. We have metal box systems from Grass, Salice and several of our own products including the Matrix family.

2/4/21       #6: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Oggie Member

Thank you all for your inputs.

Sean,
I've applied to HDL for opening an account today, hope they'll respond soon.

Scott,
I tried to open an account on Häfele website even before I posted the question here, but was unable to reach a page where one could register for an account.
I left a message regarding that problem, but nobody reached back to me as of today. That was one of many reasons I came here to complain :)
In the meantime I tried to open registration page this evening again, and this time it worked :)
I filled in the data just now and I'm waiting confirmation email.

Jim,
my customers are 95% rental management companies that take care of rental properties that are not exactly high end. The only two things they care about is price and speed. Although my cabinets are strong enough as any other, the installation needs to be fast and functional, not beautiful. The average length of cabinet/kitchen life in such environment is only a few years, due to renter's negligence, cleaning crews that soak everything in whatever chemistry they use for cleaning between two renters, painting companies that overspray everything, pest control that sprays everything, roof leaks and water pipe bursts that flood everything and occasional axe(?!) damages or some people using countertops as a chopping board and so on.
Even before old renter moves out, they already rent the unit for the next one. Usually time between old one moving out and new one moving in is less than two weeks, sometimes just a week. In that time frame drywall, painting, flooring, cleaning and many other repairs need to be done, as well as complete kitchen or at least some cabinets (if not complete kitchen than usually base cabinets and the wall cabinet above the rangehood).
They do not examine the situation till the old tenant moves out, so that leaves just a week or two to finish all those works, and usually just a day or two for kitchen installation, which has to be synchronized with all other vendors and their parts. And then I have to fabricate everything before the installation.

Cabinets need to be easily replaceable as a separate units, as well as drawers and doors. Since nobody really cares how drawers look or how they are made (just how fast and how cheap they can get them) I want to make life easier for myself. That's why metal boxes. Besides that, I myself really don't find anything wrong with them, in my kitchen or any other whatsoever. I know some people have stronger opinions on that, especially cabinet fabricators, but I don't.
However, if I could find any cheaper and faster way of doing it I would have no problems with it either.

2/4/21       #7: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Scott Markwood

Oggie, I’m really sorry to hear that you’ve hit so many dead-ends. I’m the corporate trainer and it’s been over 20 years since I was a customer, so I don’t have the latest intel on how to register online. I highly recommend calling our customer service department at 1(800)Hafele1 and thank you for your repeated attempts to conduct business with us. Scott

2/5/21       #8: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Mike D  Member

Not sure on the supply down there. But up here in Canada with the covid situation there is not too many sitting on stock. Some won't even be taking new customers as they are having a hard time filling orders as it is.
Construction is booming here. We've had two record months in a row. Hoping it levels out very soon.

2/6/21       #9: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Jeff S Member

We use legrabox and order through our Richelieu account for metal drawer boxes (which we don't do that often).
As others commented, there are a lot of parts and sizing options to order, however they seem to be in stock and arrive very quickly. They are a bit pricey and there's some labor involved with notching the bottoms as you are probably aware of.

2/9/21       #10: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Oggie Member

I've opened an account with Hafele and I had one with Richelieu from before.

However, when I called my local Richelieu store on the phone to ask if they have in store some of the items I found on their website they told me they don't carry those items here in US, only in Canada. They never bother to mention that I can still order them and have them delivered here!?
Anyway, it looks like they deliver very fast (for example 2 days for Blum Metabox and 4 days for wood dowels) and the shipping costs are reasonable and even free if order exceeds certain amount.

Hafele also seems to have reasonable shipping costs, but somewhat limited choice of drawer box systems which are mostly sold in bulks.

Thank you all for your help.
I'll try Richelieu first and see how it goes.

2/10/21       #11: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Scott Markwood

Oggie,
I'm glad that you were able to get set-up with us. Just curious, were you told that your choice of metal drawer box was only sold in bulk? I ask because there was a time when pretty much everything we sold was only available in master cartons, but for many years now we break almost all of our SPQs. One thing that confuses some folks is that we still show the SPQ in our catalog so that if someone wants to order a complete master carton, they can. Unless the item is non-stock for some reason (Unpopular finish, size, prone to damage, etc.) most of our items are available to order by the piece, pair or set.

My assumption is that it's a throwback to the days when we only sold through distribution. That ended at least 25 years ago. I remember because that's what I was a customer and joined the old "Plant Manager" program, which was Häfele America's first push to sell direct to the shop. If no one has talked to you about it you need to inquire about our "MyHäfele" program, which is the current loyalty program. Better pricing, lower freight threshold and additional benefits. Scott


View higher quality, full size image (492 X 204)

2/12/21       #12: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Oggie Member

Scott,

thank you very much for the additional explanations.
I must confess that I was not very thorough at examining all the details, I just looked for the parts I needed and found that they are sold in bulks of 5, 10 or more or something like that (maybe I just somehow missed 1 pc. option).
Anyway, even if so, those are not some large quantity increments to cause any concern.
I will look at it again in more detail and will certainly check those options you recommended.

All the best,
O.

3/1/21       #13: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Derrek

Häfele has the grass Zargen slides. They are available in bulk pallet loads and in standard Grass box quantity of 5 each. If you still need help pm me and I will send you contact info for grass rep who can hook you up.
If you commit to certain quantities, grass and Hafele will team up and give you a great deal on boring machine and assembly press for these drawers.
We are in the process of going back to Zargen drawers after about 9 years of doing side mounts. Of all the metal sided drawers they are the simplest set up and easiest to assemble

2/21/22       #14: Need reliable source for hardware ...
John Salida Member

They do not examine the situation till the old tenant moves out, so that leaves just a week or two to finish all those works, and usually just a day or two for kitchen installation, which has to be synchronized with all other vendors and their parts.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Limtech Industries, Inc. Lamello
    Today's Sponsors
    • GreCon
      Spark Detection and Extinguishment Systems and Quality Assurance Measuring Equipment
    • Excel Dowel and Wood Products Inc.
      Plain and Pre-glued Dowel Pins, and Wood Parts - Servicing Small Hobby Shops to Large OEM's
    • CP Adhesives
      Supplying Quality Adhesives to the Woodworking Industry
    • Rose Machinery
      Horizontal Band Re-rips, Standard & Custom Designed Machinery
    • Cabinet Pro
      Design and Manufacturing Software for the Cabinet and Door Industries Since 1986
    • Cab Parts
      Pre-manufactured Components for Easy-to-Assemble Cabinet Boxes
    • Colonial Saw
      North American Supplier of Striebig Panel Saws, Lamello Specialty Tools and a Wide Range of Saw and Tool Grinding Machinery
    • Palmetto Cabinet Doors
      Supplier of Quality MDF Cabinet Doors
    • Cabinetshop Maestro
      Web-Based Project Management Software for Custom Cabinet Shops - Manage Jobs from Prospect to Punchlist Through Scheduling, Task Management, Time Tracking and Communication
    • Vacuum Pressing Systems, Inc.
      Vacuum Pressing Equipment - Including Bag and Frame Systems
    • Professional Machinery Group
      New and Used Machinery Serving the Needs of the Professional Woodworker
    • Felder USA
      High Quality Woodworking Machines and Tools
    • Anver Corporation
      Vacuum System Components - Suction Cups, Vacuum Pumps, Vacuum Lifters & Lifting Systems, and More

    Become a Sponsor today!