Total Finishing Supplies

Professional Finishing

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

fisheye

11/21/20       
chris

I've been having troubles with fisheye on and off for most of this year. Hoping to get some outside perspective on what the cause might be, and whether some assumptions I've made are logical. To give some background info, this is my finishing room setup;

5hp piston compressor w/ refrigerated air dryer + desiccant dryer & filters @ booth. My air piping is 3/4" galvanized steel. We spray only Axalta solvent based conversion varnish. The finishing area is a separate building from the main wood shop so I'm confident there isn't an airborne contamination issue (silicone etc.)

We have two kremlin 10:1 systems (one for pigmented, one for clear) as well as a few gravity feed Devilbiss guns. The fisheyes are only happening when we use the pigmented kremlin set up. This leads me to believe the issue can't be related to water or oil coming from the compressor or piping system.

I thought maybe the cartridge that keeps the piston lubricant from seeping down into the chamber where the paint is could be worn, therefore allowing the lubricant to get into the paint and cause the fisheyes. We disassembled the fluid section of the pump, thoroughly cleaned everything including removing all of the lubricant from the reservoir and reassembled. We refilled the reservoir with lacquer thinner temporarily to try running the system. For about a week or so the issue was 95% solved, and then slowly started to get worse and worse again. We've been using thinner as the lubricant the whole time so I'm stumped as to what the issue could be. Is there anything in the upper air section of the pump that could be causing this issue?

At this point I'd happily spend the money on a new system, but it's kind of a gamble as I really don't have an answer on where the problem stems from. Thoughts?

11/21/20       #2: fisheye ...
Leo G Member

Are you sure it's fisheye and not something else. I've dealt with fisheye and it can be pretty devastating and notoriously hard to get rid of because you can't see the contamination.

Is it a fisheye here and there or is the substrate peckered with them?

11/21/20       #3: fisheye ...
chris

I guess it's possible that it could be something other than fisheye.

They were showing up on every piece sprayed last week. When recoated using the gravity feed gun there were none, which makes me suspect its coming from the kremlin.

11/21/20       #4: fisheye ...
Leo G Member

Well that a good sign that you don't have room contamination.

I use plain old mineral oil in the lubrication cup on my Kremlin 10:14.

Not much that can become contaminated in the pump. The hoses are one item that can hold onto contamination.

Run several different thinners through the pump. End with Denatured alcohol. Use a different cup for each one, don't recycle the thinner through the pump, just in one end and out the other and dispose.

If that doesn't work change out the fluid hose. If that doesn't work change out the air hose.

11/22/20       #5: fisheye ...
masterblaster

Simple test if it's your spray system or air. Use a large piece of glass, say 2x2. clean with acetone or alcohol using paper towels and do not blow dry. first test, turn off the atomizing air spraying with no air just paint (yes there will be streamers) and see if any fisheyes. If not clean off glass again and this time make several passes over glass like you are spraying with just the air and no material. then right away spray is as usual and see if any problems.

11/22/20       #6: fisheye ...
Jon Member

I have had what I thought was fish eye, but was actually small pecks of dried finish falling from the gun or hoses. When the dried finish fell, the wet finish would repel from the specks and look like fish eye.

I have found that keeping the gun/hoses a little cleaner has eliminated the problem. I also wear a Tyvek suit as well.

I am using a CAT AAA.

11/23/20       #7: fisheye ...
Adam

Buy a brand new hose.

If you own a conventional or gravity gun wash it with acetone.

If you don’t own one buy a new one. It’s always nice to have a decent inexpensive gravity gun on your shelf. I like the Astro Pneumatic/Starr)

Shoot something OTHER than your regular snot. You have now removed several important variables.

Then work by elimination and adding variables one at a time. You can clean the gun with acetone to keep it pristine.

Good luck contamination fish eyes are the most annoying thing in finishing.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Sponsors
    • Carter Products
      Band Saw Guides, Blades, Wheels, Tires, Line Lasers and 2D Projectors, Wide Belt Sanding Accessories, Vacuum Holding Systems and More
    • Simantech
      New & Used Machinery, Supplies, Tooling, Parts, and Abrasive Products
    • EX-FACTORY INC.
      Offering New & Used Woodworking Machinery including Auctions & Liquidations
    • TotalFinishingSUPPLIES.com
      Solutions and supplies from spray tips to spray booths for all your woodworking needs
    • Unique Machine & Tool
      Industrial Machinery for Door and Drawer Production
    • Supergrit Abrasives
      Industrial Quality Abrasives Manufactured by Leading US and Foreign Companies
    • SAMES North America Corporation
      Precision Spraying Solutions From Pumps To Complete Application Systems-Design and Manufacture of Process Equipment Including Airspray, Airmix, Airless, Rexson Dispense, Electrostatic and Powder Coat

    Become a Sponsor today!