Cabinetmaking Forum

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Buffing or Radius Scraping

4/8/16       
B

We are looking at adding a brandt ambition edgebander to be able to do frameless kitchens and smaller commercial jobs. We currently only do face frame cabinetry. This unit can be equipped with pre mill which sounds necessary? There are two stations open for either flat scraping, buffing, or radius scraping.

Could someone who uses these machines explain why I should opt for radius scraping over buffing? Im thinking scraping and radius scraping are the two most important options, but Ive never actually watched the process of an automatic bander.

Any help is appreciated!

4/9/16       #3: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
james mcgrew Member

Bump,,, I wanna hear these answers as Well I own two Brandts kd 53 and 54 and yesterday began the process of new and larger. I could learn more and will ask my guys about this, We rarely if ever have turned on the buffer.

4/9/16       #4: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
Hen Bob Member

We have a Brandt KD 77C with everything but premill. The buffer station gets used every time it runs pvc, it softens the edge so its not so sharp.

The radius scraping is for the thicker banding, 3mm & 2mm. Its necessary to clean up the cutter marks on the thicker stuff.

Wood tape gets sanded anyways so the buffing station isn't needed.

I have a new one with premill on the way so if anyone is interested in the KD77 contact me, its a great machine that runs everyday with no problems

4/10/16       #5: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
Tom C

Hi All
Got your Answer...
I have had 4 Edgebanders in 30 + years.
An Olimpic, 2 Holz-her's and and this past July we recieved a Brandt 1110 FSB edgebander.
It has Premill, Buffing and scraping.
All Manually 'Tweak-able" I can run a few test pieces.
I did not want the onscreen all adjustable,scared of the breakdown servo's ,$$ and all...

Buffing,as Hen Bob replies, it softens the edges on PVC.We turn it off for wood edges.
I try to push 1 MM as the thickness of EB that we use.
This is the most widely available to match the Tafisa Melamine we use for Cabinets,closets.
We had 1 MM round over scrapers put in.
We just did a 20 sheet closet cut-up ( SCMI Slider),
in Tafisa's Lattitude North, A texured White woodgrain.
With the set-up of Premill,1 MM scraping, Buffing.
Got the cleanest edges ever !
Premill makes the scoring blade overcut disappear.
If I could have backed in my van far enough in the shop ,
all the shelves would have went right in my van without any other handwork.
Something I could not do with the HH 1436SE I had for the last 10 Yrs of it's life.

The 2 times I have gotten requests for 3 MM EB ,One was a stock grey( Folkstone)
That was 2 years ago,We did it on the HH. Rounded it all with a 1/8" Bit in a laminate trimmer.
Lot's Of Filing !

The other time would have required us to get the 15K Ft minimum.
We just needed three rolls for that color!
Case of Architect seeing something ,goes "OH I like it", and writes it in the Specs....It's not his money...

If you are anticipating doing alot of 3MM for large commercial jobs, I would be looking at Homag's anyway.

I looked at the belt speed of the FSB1110 , Thought it was a little slow compared to others.
But the point that you can send another piece in is pretty short.
We are at about the 80 hour point where they say to take out the glue pot and clean it.
I don't know if I will skip that for a while longer,as we have kept it super clean and have not cooked the glue !.
Any advice on this ! appreciated...

All in All , I am happy with it.
Got it just under 40K on a lease from a Stiles dealer, with good 2 day training -setup from them.
Have yet to call them back on anything...
Hope this helps you out on your decision.
Tom C
Thomas Charles Cabinetry

4/10/16       #6: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
B

Great info. Thanks guys.

So it looks like the ambition 1110 top and bottom trimmers can be indexed to slighty radius the profile. This negates the need for radius scraping unless you're doing 3mm? We are also looking at the 1110 fsb, but I believe our current quote has the station control at the touch screen. I didnt know it was an option to have it removed!

4/10/16       #7: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
james mcgrew Member

has anyone price the 1210 and the 1210 fc highflex..

it looks like the gillotine has finally gone away, biggest problem we had

4/10/16       #8: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
Tom C

You are correct,
With the flic of a lever and locking bar you can go from straight to round over trimming.
Station Control ? It has a few programs onsreen for what you are running, basically the on /off for buffing ect...
You still manually move straight or radius cutters & scraping. no servos or PCS system (HH) to worry about.
Takes us less than a minute to change over now that we have done it dozens of times.
The machine was delivered with 3 mm cutters and scrapers.
We asked for the 1MM setup knowing what we do.
I did not keep the 3 mm setup for the several hundred dollars that Stiles wanted.
I know if I run into a big enough 3 MM job I can get these aftermarket cheaper somewhere.
They are Lietz brand,but my local saw guy will make any custom inserts.
I think the scrapers get it just that micron closer to perfect. I think it does it's job well.
I was never told that this was not on option ?.. on the FSB....

James-If not a Gillotine ? What-a laser sword ?
If you need more info PM me with a Phone #

4/11/16       #9: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
Larry

We've got an HH with glue scrapping, works well for a few 100' then needs to be cleaned. There is a blower on it but glue doesn't blow! Our main bander is a lot heavier and equipped with radius scrapping. We do mostly 2 & 3mm and the profile scrappers do a good job. When running very dark colors we turn on the reheat blower to shine the cut edges. The buffers work well but won't compensate for poor setup or too much glue. They have to be cleaned and moved in as they wear. Corner rounding works well & saves lots of time but the end cuts are not treated by the scrapping, buffing or reheat. Mostly we ignor that. The Scotch bright buffers work great on HPL. I've never had pre-mill. My next bander will have laser edge capability.

4/13/16       #10: Buffing or Radius Scraping ...
B

Thanks. I think we're going to go with the brandt ambition 1110fsb through stiles. Radius scraping seems unnecessary for our first machine.

James - I got prices for the brandt ambition 1210 and 1230 if you need them. Not the highflex. That baby looks nice.

  • Post a Response to this thread
  • notify me of responses to this topic
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)