So I am at a loss. I had an issue with my SCM cnc, it worked like a top, then I took some time away and while I was away the battery on the CNC and computer went flat. I changed the battery's for a total of $15.
After that I couldn't get it to run, a tech came out and looked at it and said maybe the parameters were gone as that happens when the battery goes dead. He tried to load some new parameters with Kvarna, but no luck. I contacted SCM North America and it was recommended that I get a new computer with the software pre loaded and then they would just finish up the install.
So thats what we did, new computer arrived and then they went on it and tried to download/finish the install. They got an error code on installing Kvarna and everything has come to a grinding halt, they say they have done all they can do and are waiting for ideas from the factory in Italy. With all the time changes from the west coast to the east coast to Italy, most days are wasted. it is going on two weeks and no progress.
I was wondering if anyone had any ideas or knows a tech with some ideas as I am at a total loss.
The part that really blows my mind is how $15 dollars worth of batteries can cause so many issues and so much added expense, and who knows what is next?

My lord. No input. I cant even imagine. As I read that i think of how financially crippling it would be. I just dont see how these big branded manufacturers expect people to absorb their inability.

Extremely scary to read.

Reasonably common problem...
Warning to all
Make sure if you have a cnc [or anything NC controlled] you have a BACKUP OF THE PARAMETERS!
Easy to do on most machines, remember to re-do it when tooling etc changes...

Even if they restore the factory config as in your case, there will still be a heap of calibration etc to do to get to your current setup.....

Dave,
Is it common that the Techs at SCM head quarters in Georgia can’t get it going? To me it seems like more than a common problem, but I don’ Have any idea so just curious?

No Idea, there are Techs & Techs!
We run Biesse CNCs & I am in New Zealand......
We had a motherboard fail on a CNC last year which took out the HD also, we sent the backup file to the Italians who were able to config a new PC to be "plug & play"

Yes Dave you have a very valid point, not all techs are equal as is the case with any profession I would guess.
This computer was supposed to be plug and play, so far it wont play.
I guess the part that I am struggling with the most is there seems to be no sense of urgency. Its like so sad, to bad, we will get to it sometime. I hope the factory in Italy can come up with something soon.

I do not know anything about SCM. However, I have had problems similar to what you are describing. I bought a used Brandt edgebander that had been sitting for a couple of years and the battery had gone dead and the computer on the bander lost its codes. Since I have had a CNC, I have always had someone working for me that understands computers and CAD. You really need to find someone locally that can help you.

In my case with the edgebander, it took some tech help from Stiles, but my employee was able to get it running. Later, the computer on that bander went down and my guy rebuilt it, saving us $3,000. I later had a similar problem when our computer for our AXYZ router went down. Same guy, our employee rebuilt the computer and we did not have to upgrade the Operating system on the router. That was going to cost us $15,000.

I would start calling some local computer tech support.

Jeff,
When you do get up and running and solved I suggest you buy a few "compatible" hard drives and make ghost copies of the setup and copy the configuration files.

I would also calendar battery replacements in PC's as part of a every 2 year PM.

Over time the drives that older PC's use become less than standard and 5-10 years down the road you might not be able to buy a replacement.

We always ghost the drives and back files up to our servers which are backed up both onsite and offsite.

If you keep the machine for years you may watch local / nearby auctions for "parts" machines.

For those of us buying new machines ask for a disaster recovery plan and backups to get the machine back to installed state to be included in the price or the methodology to do it ourselves.

Maybe plug a USB drive into the machine and copy files to it as local first backup for the operator. We leave a ghost drive stored in the machine and 1 on the shelf so if it fails and no ones around its easy to find.

A-

What exactly is the error when loading parameters ?

Some of the controllers require a change to English, a save, a shut down and then a reboot

A lot of times, field techs look at part swapping to get you up and running vs the culprit, and you can spend a lot more in the long run than what was anticipated.

Recently I replaced a ball screw on our z axis when the real culprit was the bearings and brake in the servo motor. I got a new ball screw and a rebuilt servo and lost approx 7 days of production It took 2 months to recover.

Parameters and tool tables should be a daily back up, such as qiickbooks, cad or other related software.

It’s difficult at first to set up procedures for back ups, but once in place, life gets a little easier We use carbonate and checklists fir everything else including vfd’s It’s tough, but boy, has it been smooth sailing to load a back up from yesterday to be running in an hour vs days.

When the battery goes bad or dies the kvara will go blank. The way to fix it is they have to replace the battery first and then run a auto setup in base menu. The auto setup will reformat the Kara drives and then it will reload the kvara files on the different drives in the kvara. Sometimes you have to re adj the parameters after a reload.

The problem all arose from the battery going dead, I believe some or all of the Kavara was lost. I guess since the machine was bought from SCM Canada, SCM in Georgia did not have the original software for the machine so they had to get it from the Factory. Because of the time changes if something doesn’t work, you have to wait until the next day. The second issue is it appears that a field tech may have caused some issues while trouble shooting it.
I am happy to say that I was contacted directly from this post from a SCM tech at their head quarters and the two techs/cnc specialists have been amazing at helping me out.
I will be the first to admit I did not understand the issues at first so was a little frustrated. I have since been explained the issues and the process.
Thanks for any ideas and assistance.

That’s great.

Please set up a protocol internally to backup your data to avoid this again.

Cabinetmaker,
Thanks for the advice, I am not sure what all that entails, but will ask?

Jeff, backing up is very easy. Go to windows explore and open the C drive, the kvara is located there. ( that goes for windows XP and win7) . You should also back up the whole scmgroup file. If you have windows 7 you go to C drive programs x86/ scmgroup. It’s best to copy the with panel Mac closed if you don’t have have panelmac that’s where xilog plus is also. You never said what model you had.

I have a Pratix S cnc router. Controller went bad on my machine too. We tried to do an autosetup and it failed. Tech said he will transfer me to the parts department and I can order a new controller. It cost $11,000. It has to be ordered from Italy. It takes a week to program and a week to ship to my shop..... I have jobs piling up, and a $11,000 bill and my shop will be dead for two weeks plus installation. And who knows if this will solve my problem. I don't understand how scm can cope with this How would a big-time production shop handle this 2 week setback?

I called SCM NA and set up a teamviewer account. It costs 480 dollars and it an annual payment. So any of you out there looking to buy a SCM machine, consider that pretty much any technical problem will require teamviewer assistance. Phone support is free but teamviewer is not.

Anyway, I am looking for a alternative to replacing my ESA controller. It cost 11,000 labor included.

Any Ideas?

How can this be prevented in the future?

Sweet Jesus I love my Thermwood....

Sorry to hear about your luck wood chopper. How old is your Pratix? Controllers go bad sometimes, it doesn’t matter what brand you are using. Just like the computer parts in an automobile, every once in awhile they go bad. It my opinion a Pratix is twice the machine a thermwood is, but you just had bad luck and Mike hasn’t had any yet. Unfortunately they will come, if you use a machine day in and day out you will start getting break downs, everything from small parts like e-stops, to ball screws to controllers to spindles. The worst part is there is no good time for a break down, regardless of the issue, you have to troubleshoot it, order parts and then change the parts. You are looking at 1 or 2 weeks or more.
I would recommend having insurance for these breakdowns. It is really cheap and will pay for down time due to issues like you are having.
Good luck on your machine.

Wood chopper

Hate to tell you but there is no alternative controller you can install on your pratix S. The cost is not 11k, it’s more like 8k with next day shipping. As for programming it, it gets programmed on the machine itself and not in Italy. Running the auto set up in base menu basically programs it’s self.

His woodworker,
I have had a few snags on my thermwood after 13 yrs, most self induced, but parts are in Indiana, and next day. Phone support is immediate and never seen a invoice for it. I've upgraded the machine and taken care of it, never been down in 13 yrs. Learned my lesson on a italian edgebander, simple parts that should be $50 costing $500 dollars, international shipping charges and still 2 weeks to get it. No thanks..

Mike,
It is just like driving a vehicle, what do you want to drive every day? A Ford or a Mercedes. We both know this debate would go on all day long with pros and cons for both. Woodworking equipment is no different. You love your thermwood and I would never buy one. All good.

His woodworker,
I prefer my 74k ford king ranch to a Mercedes also :). Paid for using my american made Thermwood. :)

Have a good day.

Mike,
The majority of people are just like you, an average person preferring average things.
Nothing wrong with that. I also like my Ford truck.
Have a great day as well.

Cris

Here are the numbers... $7,000 for the controller, $480 for the team viewer account fee, and $3,000 plus to have a tech come out and plug in all the usb cables and power cords.

If their tech does not install the controller, you have zero guarantee. If it don't solve problem you start from scratch. You have to buy ANOTHER controller and this time the tech will install. it. Its just another SCM thing. Just like charging 500 bucks to use teamviewer. I could install this controller blindfolded. But SCM is so hooked on their policies and protocols, sometimes i'm wondering if i'm talking to a machine when making a service call.

But not all Italians are the same. I have a Biesse edgebander. They have some great people working for them in tech support. They are not egotistic, they do not hold back information, and they know their machines. They don't rely on Italy if a machine is down. They also have free teamviewer support on all machines.

SCM has definitely been up to no
Good as of late. We went from an old Morbidelli to a newer one. Still not brand new. Naturally moving and getting a machine going things will happen. In the past I had great tech support from one of their techs. The other newer ones were not better then the manual. I called in for an out of service problem the other day and was told that to register the new machine it would
Cost $2800cdn to register the machine to me then $400 per year after that. This is a great machine but in general the engineering in all cnc’s is substandard and problems are sorted out post delivery. This puts SCM products out of consideration for my 3
Shops.

SCM service in Canada is a joke, period.
But if you have a YouTube or instagram account with over a million viewers SCM treats you like a god, even if all you do is make videos.

Coming to a channel near you.

Lol. Omfg.

SCM service in Canada is a joke, period.
But if you have a YouTube or instagram account with over a million viewers SCM treats you like a god, even if all you do is make videos.

SCM has taken advantage of you because their tech are notr trained on the older PLC's. They have a simple sequence of directiuons that need to be followed to do a simple reload after you enter a wake up code. I have 4 of those PLC's and they are by far the best machines if you know how to service them yourself. This info is out there but I am noticing SCm just wants to sell you newer machines and avoiding the simple sheet with proper directions they could email you in 5 minutes. I am restoring an older machine right now and I am at that very stage where I need to reload the PLC with a wake up code. I know how to do it all but I am looking for the code of the tech 100 super wake up.

Ive read all your tips and advice and as I sit on this balcony in florida my depression gets deeper.
I have an scm in the UK and my guys have reported in that the kavara unit has died. They tried the new battery play and that failed. Scm italy have remotely logged in to it ( no charge or they haven't told me) and say it needs replacing. They have managed to download the info from the old unit and sayvits 12000 pounds and 8 weeks for a replacement.
Anyone run a holzer? There's one available now and I can't see my business surviving 8 weeks.!

Sorry to hear about your issues. SCM Canada totally dropped the ball on my CNC, which was a Pratix 48. I have been reassured that the problem was the service manager and he is no longer there.
Time will tell I guess.

As for my machine I finally found a fella at SCM NA in Georgia named Rob, he worked with the folks in Italy, they were absolutely amazing, they went on my machine using teamviewer and solved the problems quick and efficiently. I am so grateful. It just took me awhile to find the right people in the company.

Where I live the area is very large, my shop is mostly SCM equipment, I love the equipment when it is running good, I will be the first to say I don’t have many issues, but when I do, there is only 1 tech who in my opinion is any good. What are the chances of him showing up anytime soon. I feel sorry for him as well because he needs to be in 3 different places at the same time. Would be nice if they had more qualified techs.

I think SCM makes good equipment, but when you look at there marketing and social media that I see, they are absolutely clueless. I guess that happens when head office is so far away!

I hope you get your issues sorted quickly.

Thanks Jeff. Are you able to give me Robs email on this forum. It's got to be worth a conversation with him if nothing else. He might know where there's a spare part on NA that I can buy to get yo and running again.
Iain

Iain,

Sorry I don’t have Rob’s email, all my communication with him was by phone, I would call SCM in Georgia at 17708138818 and talk to the receptionist and then he would call me back. He set up all the communication with Italy as well, I would give him the code to get on teamviewer and leave my machine on at night and Italy would log on at their convenience.

Thanks

The company I work for has 4 SCM machines. Two i-5 programmable shapers, One SIX 10' slider and a 5 head Super set Shaper also programmable. They all have issues. Both shapers are currently down one going on 4 weeks down. Both with issues with fence movement. The slider was down 28 days a month ago. with a simple loose connection. Oh and be aware that SCM does not accept returns on electronic parts. So our loose connector cost us $1,702 even though they recommended changing out the SRF card on the mother board, and it was not the problem. The tilt motor on the saw is under powered enough to error out the PLC every time we need to cut an angle. We are using a 2x2x6' solid oak lever bar to make the dam thing move to position. There is no fix for this problem. Their service department will never call back even if you call daily for help. My independent techs say the same thing. The shaper has some backward wiring that took the installing tech days to figure out. RUN AWAY FROM SCM.