Safety Speed Cut Thermwood Corporation ECabinet Systems

Cabinetmaking

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Gap when making frame and panel shaker style cabinet

2/16/22       
Peter

I am making Shaker style kitchen cabinets for a customer - painted. This is not my first time making these cabinets. My first project resulted in a small gap between the plywood panel and the wood frame, which the customer was not happy about.

I've tried making the panel and groove as snug as possible but there is still spots that show a small gap when painted. Does anyone have a trick for eliminating the gap between the 1/4 inch plywood panel and the frame? Again, these cabinets are painted using a cream colour paint which accentuates the gap.

2/16/22       #2: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Edi Silva

Honestly, I replace all my old Cutters and the new ones that we buy from Freeborn, I request the ease edge, so we have that small radius between frame and panel, not too big, not too small just enough so the paint doesn't have that build up. We primed our panels (Tinted to match finish color) so in case of shrinkage, you don't see that brown line from the MDF, we use CV for paint with the right amount of Mills. 4 out 5 kitchens we are doing now days are Shaker, never had 1 single complained regarding that radius. BTW, we use 3/8'' MDF for panels and back cut to fit the 1/4'' groove.
You said: "I've tried making the panel and groove as snug as possible", what are you using to make your doors? All the sets I know (Unless ordered custom) comes with 1/4'' groove cutter and most the plywood I know isn't 1/4''.

2/16/22       #4: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Kevin Dunphy

Website: http://www.kdunphy.com/

Do you use MDF doors or not

I tell customers about the gap beforehand and show them [ need sample or showroom] and explained MDF is cheap cardboard
What worked better for me is using solid mdf panel reversed

It's getting silly about the gap wood will always have a gap somewhere

The last thing customer doesn't know is the difference between laminate high gloss white and polished high gloss white, of course the cost difference. When you explain they think your lying

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-Jd2mra1bOlY3127DF7jew

2/16/22       #6: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Peter

Thanks all for the quick responses. I use 1/4 plywood for the panels. I cut the groove using two passes over the table saw to get the right width of groove for the plywood. I'll try priming the panel before I assemble to see if that helps and easing the edge slightly.

Your advice is much appreciated.

2/16/22       #7: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
D Brown

In a pinch You can also shoot a 5/8" pin behind the panel between the frame and panel, this will push the panel forward.

I never had a complaint about it.

2/16/22       #8: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Cris

MDF is not cheap cardboard. We have found it to be the perfect mtl. for paint grade doors. 1 piece paint doesn't crack at rail and style joint. Doesn't shrinking and swelling during seasonal changes. doesn't bridge at panel to rail and style intersection. Prep time is zero. Takes paint wonderfully. The biggest problem we have with products like this is we have been telling customers that these products are garbage for so long that we now believe it. During the downturn years 2009 -2013 we got into doing restoration "water damage" and got quite the education. MDF and particle board heal up just as good as plywood and lumber. These two products were engineered for the cabinet industry.

2/16/22       #9: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Bruce H

It's a learning curve to spray so that doesn't happen. In your case I'd calk the joint so the paint makes a smooth transition between panel and style. We would do this after the first primer coat. Re-prime and then top coat. We do pre-prime the panels before assembly. Next time experiment with spraying just enough so it is covered but no so much the paint puddles at the style panel joint.

2/16/22       #10: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Kevin Dunphy

Website: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-Jd2mra1bOlY3127...

Chris, please post your website love seeing other people's work.

Pure garbage MDF and Particleboard that's the tune if your small and want to stay in business most small guys can't compete with a 2 shift 50 person shop pumping out particle board cabinets all-day. So you have to be special unique if I had the money I would hire Dave before he kicks off his work will be worth a lot after hes gone. We have to say were artist period and artists only use the best material.

2/16/22       #11: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
David R Sochar Member

1/4" ply is not 1/4" . Size your plows to fit w h at they are selling you. A n f plea a e stay away from MDF. You cannot compete with the cheep boys so you should be using the best of materials and working the top of the market.
My opinion, alone

2/16/22       #12: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
D Brown

You can specify what they call true 1/4" .

2/16/22       #13: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Peter Gausden

Thanks again. Lots of good suggestions. I'd like to stay with a plywood panel if possible. I'll try pre-priming the panel before assemble and keep my groove as tight as possible. I have put together some doors to try some of the suggestions in the thread.

Much appreciated.

2/16/22       #14: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Jim

We've produced 1000s of doors with MDF panels
We find it superior for paint grade
It's dimensionally stable, flatter, doesn't telegraph grain thru the finish, and adds some weight to the door
My supplier offers raw mdf, mdf core veneered panels in 1/4" and 5.2mm and veneer core plywood in 5.2mm in certain species
I usually order veneered panels on mdf core when possible with matching veneer or mill option back for the same reason as above.
You can order your cutters with 5.2mm if you want to stay with the inferior plywood or 1/4" if you're using true 1/4 panels

2/16/22       #15: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
door shop guy

Split adjustable groover from Freeborn.

2/21/22       #16: Gap when making frame and panel sha ...
Dhahr Member

You’d have to be sending those rails and stiles over the table saw perfectly twice to get that groove the same width across each stole and rail. If you’re small time like me, just get a good adjustable groove cutter for the router or shaper and use a good featherboard to make sure the groove is parallel to the parts. Then follow the above tips for painting and caulking if needed.

Dan


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Limtech Industries, Inc. Lamello
    Today's Sponsors
    • KCD Software
      Powerful 3D Cabinet/Closet Design Software with Built-In Touchscreen Mode for Mobile Use with Best Production Practices Including Direct to Cut List, Cabinotch and/or CNC Machining
    • OMEC/Macoser Inc
      Exclusive Importer of European Woodworking Machinery Since 1988
    • Baker Products
      Industrial Woodworking Machines, Wooden Pallet Manufacturing Machines, & Portable Sawmills
    • Charles G.G. Schmidt Co.
      Tooling for Shapers, Moulders, Tenoners, Planers and Routers
    • iBiDMachinery
      The Nation's #1 Used Woodworking Marketplace - Buy and Sell Woodworking Equipment with iBiD!
    • Parts Cutter CNC
      CNC Cabinetry and Closet Parts
    • Salice America Inc.
      Leading Manufacturer of Functional Hardware for Cabinets and Furniture, Including Concealed Hinges, Drawer Slides, Lift Systems, Coplanar Sliding Door Hardware
    • Country Saw and Knife
      Complete Sharpening Services for Wood and Metal Saw Blades, Jointer Knives, and Bandsaw Blades
    • TotalFinishingSUPPLIES.com
      Solutions and supplies from spray tips to spray booths for all your woodworking needs
    • O'Shea Lumber Company
      Merchants of Fine Woods
    • Rangate
      Woodworking Machinery, Supplies and Knowledge
    • Rose Machinery
      Horizontal Band Re-rips, Standard & Custom Designed Machinery
    • Professional Machinery Group
      New and Used Machinery Serving the Needs of the Professional Woodworker

    Become a Sponsor today!