Well, I have exhausted my avenues trying to use H3D insert tooling. Have not been able to make one cabinet door. Stiles and rails are way too loose. Tried 3 separate sets of inserts and the mfg states that the problem is run-out in a brand new 5hp PM2700. Run-out is .0012..sounds good to me. Going back to stack cutters and shims. Will be selling an almost unused set of insert bodies. Any information about the quality of Misenheimer heads or another manufacture? Thanks

i have been using freeborn split body tooling since years with great success.
knifes hold up great.keeps the sharpening for a longer period of time without needing to change.Comes with variety of shims to tolerate the runout.
Got my last shaker set from ebay last year around $400 and for me it paid for it self more than 100 times.

Brand new machinery doesn't mean what it used to. I've always thought Powermatic was over rated.

Rich, the Powermatic that we bought is a huge step better than the Weavers we were using. The runout is almost zero. Could not justify an SCM or one of that quality. Yavuz, we have a lot of regular Freeborn cutters and such. Just wanted to try the insert tooling bodies because I have read so much good about them. If they worked good they would be a lot faster than stacked cutters and shims.

Thomas i am talking about insert tooling.i dont have any regular type.All insert type replaceable toolings.

Look at the tool body without the inserts in. Is the insert bed flat with no burrs? If you have a dial indicator rotate the head and check to see if each insert is at the same height when set into the tool. Resin build up is a good indicator of what edge is cutting where.

Sorry to hear that you are not having much luck.
I use insert tooling for all my cabinet doors, all my cutters are Royce Ayre and the results are always exceptional. One of my shapers is a pioneer which was manufactured offshore and would be similar quality to yours. I bought it new at auction when the company selling them closed.

Tom, the tool is brand new. I have only made two cuts with them. Sent the tool back to the manufacture and they said everything was fine. Run out is good. Tool body has no visible flaws. Dial indicators is within .003 on carbide tips.
Scott, I will look up Royce Ayre. Thanks for the tip.

I've run Freeborn Insert tooling in multiple dedicated profile heads for several years with no problems.
Also, I'm running them on Weaver shapers.

My guess is the cut on the inserts is off. I bought a set from one of the tooling supply shops in my area and they were terrible.
You checked the runout on the shaper so that is good, The only other thing that has been mentioned is the cutters aren’t all installed properly, or if you have a bad shim on your spindle? The bad spindle shim is rare, but I have come across it, and you most likely aren’t even using shims.

My guess is the cut on the inserts is off. I bought a set from one of the tooling supply shops in my area and they were terrible.
You checked the runout on the shaper so that is good, The only other thing that has been mentioned is the cutters aren’t all installed properly, or if you have a bad shim on your spindle? The bad spindle shim is rare, but I have come across it, and you most likely aren’t even using shims.

Freeborn split body carbide insert tooling.Jet 5 hp 1-1/4" spindle.similar to your shaper. One of the reasonably priced quality tooling.
Split body is a big improvement over single body non adjustable one. Once you try you will never wanna go back to headache :)

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My guess is the cut on the inserts is off. I bought a set from one of the tooling supply shops in my area and they were terrible.
You checked the runout on the shaper so that is good, The only other thing that has been mentioned is the cutters aren’t all installed properly, or if you have a bad shim on your spindle? The bad spindle shim is rare, but I have come across it, and you most likely aren’t even using shims.

Thanks all for the responses. Everything I have checked turns out well. I can only attribute it to the one piece insert tooling body. Yavuz, I have not considered the split body insert cutters. I will definitely look into this option. Thank you

Twelve tenths is pretty good?

That's why your joints fit like crap. Your spindle is almost certainly out of tram as well.

Insert tooling is cut usually at a zero tolerance. If your shaper is running true and the workpiece holding adequate your parts will not go together. The manufactures count on there being some inadequacies in the machine and that buys them the slop needed.

Try them in a healthy and quality shaper and you'll see a world of difference.

I went through a similar situation years ago. Cheap shapers cost too much.

Karl, I appreciate and respect your input. However, I would not consider a new Powermatic 2700 a cheap shaper. I know a lot of people who use them for mfg. of doors. Run out on our shaper is .0012. I don't know if it is possible to get any tighter tolerance than that. I could be wrong bu I figured 12 thousandths was acceptable. What do you believe run out should be?

It is a cheap shaper. I've owned my fair share of yellow equipment. Hobbyist grade.
I've rebuilt that quill a few times. Tiny bearings.

I'd want to see below .0005 on something brand new.

Where did it come out when you checked the tram of the spindle?

Are you measuring runout directly on the spindle or off of a collar clamped in? Does your number change from top to bottom?

I am not here to offend anyone as the majority of woodworkers have different needs and circumstances. I am referring to the types of jobs you want to do with your equipment, the size and phase of your electrical service and anothet important factor is your budget.

Yellow equipment like powermatic, or grizzly, the Pioneer I have and many similar machines would be considered lower end machines, they have cheaper bearings, etc. They are manufactured off shore and a lot of them in the same factories. There is nothing wrong with that if it meets your needs.

If you are using a shaper all the time the minimum I would look for is a SCM, if you have a large budget get a Martin. These shapers are a lot better quality.
Shapers are a dyeing piece of equipment for a lot of companies as they are using CNC’s to machine all their door parts.

Keep an eye out and you can find some really good deals on used equipment.
You can also upgrade the bearings on most shapers to give you better fit and finish.

Scott, your post was not offensive in the least. We use old equipment as well as some new. Our main workhorse is a cnc. We have a early 1900's Crescent 24" jointer, an 80,s model 37inch widebelt. I buy old because I like to rebuild them and they last a long time. We used Weaver shapers for years with stack tooling. Getting old and down sizing so we sold the weavers and bought a new Powermatic. Contrary to some, it is a good machine. It fits our need and I am quite sure it will outlive me. Thank you for the response.

I'm with Karl on this one, I have a few different brands of insert tooling, and some custom made. All work as they should.
In the early years we had a Delta ( Taiwanese machine ) and grizzly shapers. Then got a Moak #9 and never looked back. The difference was night and day even with a 60 year old shaper. Now we are running SCM and Panhans shapers

Keep an eye out for a used SCM, should be able to get a T110 for 2K or less. that will help immensely

I've used Grizzly stacked sets with good results, under $300 for 1.25 arbor shaper. I have 2 sets available for sale at $100 each; one for 1-3/8" doors and one for 1-3/4" doors. I also have a 6-piece set of Charles GG Schmitt stacked cutters for 7/8-1" cabinet doors currently sells for over $700, will sell for $250. Includes sample set-up pieces. This is a flawless cutter set. Email me for photos. Also have many corrugated knife sets, and large carbide wing cutters for sale $35 each. Tony tonytere3534@gmail.com