Message Thread:
Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2:
3/7/17
Plans have changed. After planing one side of the boards to make them 3/4" thick, I've decided to use the slick side up in this truck bed. Figure to use a marine coating (similar to undercoating) on the rough (bottom) side of the boards and have decided on a finish product for the smooth side of these wormy chestnut boards called D-Dur PU Clear TC (product # 620-1XX) from Chemcraft. It is purported to have excellent durability characteristics as a water and UV repellant for outdoor wood applications. Plan to use a matte clear finish. There is a distributor here in town. It has a rather complex application process but the guys at the distributor say they have experience and will apply it for a "nominal" fee (steak dinner)! Who wants to argue with this? Believe me...arguments and opinions are welcome! I've researched outdoor wood finishes for weeks and this is the best I've come up with. Anybody care to weigh in? Thanks!
3/8/17 #3: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
I would have held out for a possum roast with coon gravy.
3/8/17 #4: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Dash,
I am sure the planed boards are beautiful.
I really do not have much experience with Exterior coatings, or with using Wormy Chestnut in an exterior installation.
The closest I have come to this is, using WC on a front door. I used 2K poly on the door and after several years the door still looks great. But this door gets 0 sun exposure thanks to an extensive front porch, which blocks from sun and the elements. Pick a finish you are comfortable using and have at it!
Please send pics when you are done.
All the best,
DCS
3/8/17 #5: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
I'm not sure what would be your best finish for the chestnut but I will tell you that it is extremely weather resistant wood on it's own. Although it is relatively soft as has been stated, it holds up well to moisture. In the northeast, you can still find chestnut fence posts that have lasted for nearly 100 years. At one time (colonial days) chestnut was the wood of choice for split rail fencing and rivaled only by cedar and locusts for posts. I've had the pleasure of using it for interior cabinetwork myself ( one of my favorites), but I've never built anything using it for outdoors. I wonder if a good exterior clear oil finish, re-applied yearly might be better than a film type finish though. Just because the wood holds up well, doesn't mean the finish will hold up with seasonal movement and all. Then you're dealing with peeling, cracking, etc. issues.
3/10/17 #6: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Thanks for all the responses! I thought I had settled on the D-DUR Chemcraft coating but now inclined to agree with John. Eventually, the stuff is gonna crack, peel, and otherwise wreak havoc. Then I'm stuck taking the bed apart to refinish. I'm considering John's suggestion of applying clear oil so that I can just basically give it a new coat every year. The steel bed strips dividing the boards will be primed and painted rustoleum satin black. I think I cold just wipe a new coat on the boards periodically and just wipe any excess off the strips. What say y'all about Danish Oil?
3/11/17 #7: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Why don't you apply some WD40 on a piece of scrap wood and see how it behaves. You really have nothing to lose.
Considering an oil finish as opposed to a film coating is a wise move. Those types of coatings are fine for kitchens and baths etc.....but the bed of a truck that gets a bit more extreme use would cause scratches, dents. Once water migrates through those dents and scratches, the coating would begin to deteriorate.
I know that the WD40 is not commonly used as a coating, but its proved itself to be a great moisture repellent AND its easy to apply and then reapply when needed.
3/11/17 #8: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
You've got to be kidding, WD40 as a wood finish? Use that if you want people to smell you coming down the street! Or if you like reapplying it every week. It's nearly all solvent. Hell, back in the day when trucks were used on the farm to work, instead of used like a car, used motor oil was also a coating of choice. Maybe coat it with used oil and then wipe down with WD40! Best of both worlds!
3/11/17 #9: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
I forgot to ask about your thoughts on getting caught in the occasional rain shower and all the worm holes in the chestnut filling with water? Or is this just going to be show truck and not go outside?
3/11/17 #10: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
You've got to be kidding, WD40 as a wood finish? Use that if you want people to smell you coming down the street! Or if you like reapplying it every week. It's nearly all solvent. Hell, back in the day when trucks were used on the farm to work, instead of used like a car, used motor oil was also a coating of choice. Maybe coat it with used oil and then wipe down with WD40! Best of both worlds!
3/11/17 #11: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
All good points! I was going for a basic restoration on the short bed stepside 59 GMC and wanted it to look aged. But it's turning out much nicer than I wanted so I'm having to make adjustments. Sanding the new shiny paint down to a matte finish using a product called "Scuff Stuff" and gray scotchbrite pads. It's working great! The "scuff stuff" might interest you guys as an alternative to sandpaper or steel wool. Buy it at NAPA. The bed will be mostly in the dry but will see occasional rain and plenty of sun. I read of "Danish oil" with a UV inhibitor but it's in Europe. Don't know if I can get it past customs. Regular Danish oil is not going to work. The water repellent and UV properties are what's needed. A guy on youtube used 30% helmsman spar mixed with 70% teak oil. Still seems like it would be susceptible to peeling/flaking. Plus...the truck will get washed frequently...couple times a month. What say y'all about water repellent, UV repellent alternatives to Danish oil? Are there any?
3/13/17 #12: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Come on Dash, are you going to ask about every recipe you find on the internet? Go to wood boat forums and ask them. Nearly everyone will tell you what to use, then how to refinish it in 3 years. All wood pickup beds rot at some rate. You choose. You get water trapped under the straps, you get the sun beating down on it, you get mud and grime thrown up on the bottom. Rot is the reason you can't buy a wood floored pickup bed today. Pretty hard to compete with galvanized steel.
3/14/17 #13: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
I work on all types of boats. We use Bristol for almost all the bright work. If you don't beat it up too bad, it will last a few years with a little maintenance.
Bristol Traditional Amber
3/14/17 #14: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Rich C,
LMAO here! I've read stuff online for hours and cannot come up with a consensus. It seems there are as many opinions out there as there are woodmen...and that's not a bad thing. About the wood bed in the old truck, I know most are done with oak, pine or ash. But to hear someone who knows wood at a cruise-in or car show say "holy crap...this bed is wormy chestnut"...will make it all worthwhile. I know it's an off-the-wall idea, but it's gonna be interesting. Just FYI, there's a movement to install wood beds over the top of late model steel beds just to get the old wood bed look. Guys are buying kits to install wood beds in brand new trucks, complete with stainless strips. They just lay the stuff down on top of the steel bed and poof...instant classic look! I'm doing mine this way just for the conversation starter. "What kinda wood you got in that there truck bed"? Old timers might know, but a woodman will figure it out pretty quick. It'll be fun while it lasts, and therein lies the question. How do I make it last? I'm still leaning toward a clear matte or satin oil finish with water-repellent and UV blocking capability. Just don't know what it is yet. I don't care to do annual or semi-annual maintenance if it only involves wiping a new coat of oil on every couple of months. Should be easier than taking the wood up and re-sanding/re-finishing every year or so. Oh...I also plan to undercoat the bottom of the wood like they did from the factory to take care of road dirt, water, and any other garbage. Yep...it's all counter-intuitive, but fun nonetheless! So work with me here Rich. Give me a product name that I can apply like the Karate Kid. Wax on, wax off!
3/14/17 #16: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Keeping it simple sounds like a plan. This might be the product you're looking for. I've used the Thompson Water Sealer quite a few times and had good results. The Timber Oil is a fairly new product, but sounds like what you are looking for. No film coating, ease of application (one coat), with UV protection and mildew resistance. Whatever you do, keep us informed and post some pictures. Good luck.
Thompson Timber Oil
3/15/17 #17: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
If you are looking for the WOW factor I would suggest using curly Catalpa for the wood. Their jaw will drop when they hear and see what you are using their jaws will drop.
3/15/17 #18: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
I know plenty about wooden truck beds. I lived on the farm when we had them for hauling everything from corn to pigs, or you could buy a pickup from the factory with no bed at all and you made your own wood flat bed. My Dad built pickup flatbeds as a job at a family lumberyard when he was a kid, 1936. I also own a 1948 F1 Ford. In reference to those guys that plop down hardwood on top of steel and strap it down with stainless, let's hope they never get the truck in rain or wash it with a hose. Once that bed fills up with water, you get trapped water under the wood and you will have cupping like you never imagined. Then it starts to rot from water getting trapped and soaking into the end grain! That's why wood bed trucks are open on the bottom. Wood needs to be able to dry out quickly and have even air flow all around. Also the reason the old work truck beds used "vertical grained wood", quarter sawn wood will not cup. Hell, the guy that did the truck I bought, used plywood for the bed. Can't say how many months it took that to start to delaminate and rot. I knew it was plywood, and with over 40 years of woodworking, I bought it knowing that would be the first thing I fixed. If you know nothing about wood, you can do anything once. But you'll learn a quick lesson when it goes badly.
3/16/17 #19: Concerning wormy chestnut...Part 2: ...
Man...these are great points! Many thanks to Rich C. and the Cajun Craftsman. That's quite an education Rich. You're right...I expect I'll learn from experience about what works. The only common thread I've found is that nothing is gonna last forever. I'll likely regret using the wormy chestnut but it'll be fun while it lasts. I had to make a decision before I went crazy trying to figure it out and took the Cajun Craftsman's advice. Went to HD last night and picked up a gallon of Thompson's natural timber oil. It is a fairly new product from those guys and the research says it has excellent water and UV repellent properties. Also recommends only one coat initially. What you said about the wood being able to breathe and dry quickly is a new twist. I've seen the old trucks with undercoating on the bottom of the wood. Maybe not such a good idea. I've also heard of guys standing the wood in a bucket overnight with the ends immersed in the oil to soak up as much as possible. Remember when the old timers built a fence using wood posts and they would coat the top of the post with tar? There are fence posts still standing on a nearby farm from nearly 80 years ago with the tar still intact. I think the posts are mostly locust. Anyways, I'll apply a coat of timber oil on the top, round off the edges and ends and coat them, and then spray a thin layer of undercoating on the bottom and see what happens. I'll minimize exposure to water. If it gets wet, it'll be totally unexpected as in a pop up thunderstorm at a car show. I'll wash the truck without getting a drop on the wood and keep it garaged at all times. It'll fail eventually but maybe I can bring it back with light sanding and another coat of timber oil. I thank you for all your advice and many thanks to the Cajun Craftsman for the timber oil suggestion. I researched the product and it's UV protection and ease of application is what convinced me. I believe the UV effects are going to be the main factor in the degradation of the finish so I'll apply a fresh coat when it feels right and see what happens. I will keep all y'all posted on the outcome and the longevity of the timber oil. Going to get to work on it tomorrow.
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