Total Finishing Supplies

Professional Finishing

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Painting over 'footballs' in russian/baltic birch

8/29/19       
Matt Meadows

We are building some small cabinets that are specifically made from baltic/russian birch due to some of it's characteristics (rigidity and core quality).

The "football" plugs however are giving us a little grief in the paint booth. The client isn't thrilled with the way the outer perimeter of the football plug can telegraph through the finish.

We spray a fairly high solids CV, and we've tried every trick we know to hide the footballs, and the final result is hit or miss. Some disappear totally, but most you still see a bit of a witness to the oval shape even after 3 coats, sanded aggressively.

We've tried using putty, bondo, etc to fill in that tiny hairline ring that can result but nothing is a sure-bet.

We're not exactly keen on switching materials to something like common domestic C3/B2 Maple because we need the core integrity of the Baltic birch.

Anyone have any tips on this?

8/29/19       #2: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Tom Gardiner

Spec a higher grade of Russian birch. BB/BB can include patches and putty fill but B/BB will have one clear face.

8/29/19       #3: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
cwk

if you have to use that material you can always lay up the end/seen panels with a backer sheet or liner material then paint that. will come out perfect.

8/29/19       #4: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
David R Sochar Member

Drip cyanoacrylate glue along the joints, let is set fully, and then sand. Re-drip any areas that are not bonded 100%. Your aim is to bond the entire football at the surface - the joint between faces.

But buying better Baltic Birch brings better boxes, as I always say.

8/29/19       #5: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Adam 312

David Sochar
Bravo maestro
The finishers I work with would take that trade secret to the grave.
If they had that knowledge they wouldn’t share it.
Respect from Chicago
Adam

8/30/19       #6: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Thomas

Matt,
Check your specs on ordering. B/BBB would be your best choice. The BBB has no patches on that side. We use lots of Baltic Birch for one company that we manufacture for. Sometimes when we can't get B/BBB and have patches on the face side we will use Bondo auto body filler. If the patches are not too bad we can use auto body glazing putty. Both work great and we have never had a problem with bleed through.

8/30/19       #7: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Shane

Honestly a good finisher can polish a turd.... In this case your finisher is not using a good enough primer surfacer or he isn't getting enough millage laid down. I would build up primer coats well past acceptable dry mills, let cure and then proceed to rough sand back flat. This process, if done correctly will fill any voids and render the surface perfectly flat and no voids after it's sanded back thoroughly. Get the primered surface perfect and your topcoat will lay out beautiful... IMO

9/1/19       #8: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Tom Gardiner

Just to clarify, B face is free of splits or patches, BB can have putty and patches. I have never encountered a BBB designation but confusion might exist because I hear contractors calling for triple B at the order desk when they want B/BB.

9/2/19       #9: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Matt

Understood, gentlemen. Most of what you're saying is what I expected.

Let me feed this info upstream.

9/2/19       #10: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
dan shaf Member

A couple of different approaches, piling on primer and grinding it down to smooth, and using CA glue to skim over and to fill in the tiny seams.

For me, the CA glue is more production friendly than is laying down an overly thick coat of primer. Similarly, when prepping furniture for delivery and there's a bondo or epoxy putty repair to be done, the CA glue is a go-to to skim over the bondo or epoxy putty fill. It acts as a barrier coat and hides any seams that seem to want to telegraph through the topcoat no matter how smoothly sanded.

Each option for dealing with these fills has its tradeoffs.

Does everyone don a mask with a cartidge filter when using CA glue? Don't breath that stuff, even when you're sanding it. It's pernicious and nasty. Wear your mask. If you have a beard, either shave it or wear a fresh air supplied positive feed respirator. Safe finishing is no accident.

9/11/19       #11: Painting over 'footballs' in russia ...
Adam 312

Don’t huff Cyanoacrylate
Ok?
A


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)