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Question....

9/30/20       
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

Directions for air pressure for a product I use is to use 30 lbs atomizing air pressure. Is that the same thing as 30 psi ?? I don't recall any product calling for that much air if it's the same as psi. I'm using a 12:1 ratio air assisted airless and also a 14:1 at other times if that helps. Thanks in advance.

10/1/20       #2: Question.... ...
herb johnson

Directions for air pressure for a product I use is to use 30 lbs atomizing air pressure. Is that the same thing as 30 psi

two different things, , your spec sheet is most likely referring to someone using the old style air atomizing gun like a devilbiss jga gun or a binks 2001 gun or binks 7 gun.

old school but servicable guns. now new world which is what you are using is air assisted airless and we use terms like hydraulic pressure for atomizing pressure, i.e. pump pressure say you have a 10-1 pump x incoming pump pressure of 50 psi ergo you have 500 psi of hydraulic atomizing pressure.

what i would do is contact your material mfg for clarification because i believe they are referring to old school air atomized pressure ratings not new age hvlp or air assisted pressure recommendations.

hope this helps

good luck
herb j.

10/1/20       #3: Question.... ...
Leo G Member

If they stated that in reference to a AAA then yes, the 30lbs would be 30psi. If they didn't state that it was for a AAA then it might be or it might be Herb's answer.

Spray it and see how it lays out. Adjust it until you like it. Instructions are a starting point, real life determines what your settings will actually be.

10/2/20       #4: Question.... ...
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

Thanks for the response guys. I'll quote what was said as it seems to be talking about air assisted airless since is suggesting 420 lbs fluid pressure. The product is M L Campbell pigmented conversion varnish.

" It is also recommended to use 30 lbs atomizing air pressure and 420 lbs
fluid pressure to achieve maximum results.

10/2/20       #5: Question.... ...
mastercabman Member

Stan
Which product from MLC are you using?

10/2/20       #6: Question.... ...
Leo G Member

Well if it's Stealth I usually use 40psi fluid, 22 psi air with a 12-174 and 06-114 tips. I thin the Stealth 20% with a thinner mixture of 1/3 Flow enhancer #2 and 2/3 Reducer.

I make a batch of the thinner mixture and put it into it's own can and just pour out of that at the 20% thinning rate.

10/2/20       #7: Question.... ...
mastercabman Member

I checked my MLC chart and if using stealth
If using a CAT 14/1 pump with a 409 tip
Air pressure 15-18 psi
Fluid pressure 560 psi or 40 psi at regulator

10/2/20       #8: Question.... ...
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

mastercabman....
The product I'm talking about is Turino.

10/3/20       #9: Question.... ...
mastercabman Member

The product I'm talking about is Turino

Must be a recent product
Don't have it on my chart and I got it about 5 years ago

Best thing to do it's to call MLC directly
Let them know what equipment you're using

10/3/20       #10: Question.... ...
DannyB Member

Turino is a fairly new product (last year i think).

It's a pigmented post-cat with a 24 hour pot-life.
See here: https://www.mlcampbell.com/product/turino-pigmented-conversion-varnish/

It does suggest 30 psi atomizing air pressure, 420psi fluid pressure (after compression) for a AAA.

Those are the same settings that ML Campbell suggests for Stealth (after 25% suggested reduction).

Turino suggests only 5% reduction, but otherwise seems like the settings people use for stealth might be a good starting point.

10/3/20       #11: Question.... ...
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

Thanks for the responses good people. I was having trouble with orange peel and doing some reading about the Turino when I read the 30 PSI and hadn't used anything that suggested that much air pressure. I was able to get a pretty good coat on today by using 10% reducer and 15% flow enhancer 1. But perhaps I can increase the air pressure and do away with some of the air pressure?? What do you all think about that??

10/3/20       #12: Question.... ...
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

"But perhaps I can increase the air pressure .... and do away with some of the reducer and flow enhancer??

Edited to make sense hopefully. :)

10/4/20       #13: Question.... ...
Daniel Shafner Member

I use Turino often. It's my go-to pigmented coating in light & pastel colors. I add 10% catalyst - of course! - and I add 10% reducer. I don't add Flow Out Enhancer #2 unless I'm fearful of pinholes, and so far, no need for it.

In the 14:1 C.A.Technologies pump I dial in 40 for the fluid pressure and 23 lbs air pressure. I use a 611 tip and also a 411 tip.

In the Graco Merkur ES 30:1 pump I dial in 30 for fluid pressure and 23 psi air pressure. I use an M411 tip, an M509 tip, and an M611 tip.

The air pressure is only to get rid of the tails on your spray fan. Atomization of your finish comes from the fluid being squeezed through the tip's orifice.

It would be better to dial in your settings by learning to see your burst of spray, dialing in a good looking pattern and then using your air settings to get rid of your tails. For example, you don't want a pattern that looks like drops of rain. Therefore, kick up the fluid pressure for finer atomization. And then adjust your air to get rid of the tails.

Recently, MLC developed a clear stain base in Turino for mixing in dark colors. The stuff doesn't want to dry. What a nightmare.

Turino conversion varnish in light colors is wonderful to use. Here's a huge advantage of MLC over Axalta and other mfg's: no dwell time (sweating in time) with the use of catalyst. Catalyze your coating, mix it well, and start shooting. Other mfg's need a 10 - 20 minute wait time for the catalyst to start to kick their coating.

Spraying Resistant is like spraying rubber. Spraying Stealth is ok, but it uses irs own reducer, not the standard lacquer thinner. It doesn't have a 24 hour pot life. Plus, like Resistant, it's thick out of the can.

Turino is our default non-yellowing CV. Resistant can yellow over time. It's not non-yellowing.

10/4/20       #14: Question.... ...
Leo G Member

Stealth uses it's own reducer is a new one on me. I use all the standard thinners with Stealth. I have found a mixture of #2 and reducer work the best for me.

Please explain.

10/4/20       #15: Question.... ...
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

Daniel Schafner....

Is the 23 psi for air pressure before or after triggering??

Thanks everyone!!!

10/4/20       #16: Question.... ...
Leo G Member

Air pressure should always be with the trigger pulled. We can't know what pressure drops you'll have over the run of pipe in your air system.

10/4/20       #17: Question.... ...
stan merritt  Member

Website: http://www.basicwood.org

Leo G
Makes sense to me.
My air pressure drop while triggering is about 3.5 million PSI. I live so far back in the "holler" that I have to order my air pressure over the internet. :)

10/7/20       #18: Question.... ...
Shane Welch

just to add my $.02 about coating that require their "#whatever number" for reducers and retarders.... Pull up the MSDS sheet and see what the blend is made off..... then mix your own coctails to suit your needs at half the cost of their specific reducers/retarders..... If it's varnish... it's usually a cocktail of Butyl acetate (Reducer), butyl cellosolve (Retarder)and EEP (Retarder)....... some acetone... eductae yourself with spec sheets and msds !

10/7/20       #19: Question.... ...
Leo G Member

Problem with that is you void any warranty the finish may have. Albeit they are usually pretty lame ie: replace the cans of finish but nothing for the labor which of course is 90% of the repair.

10/8/20       #20: Question.... ...
Shane Welch

Yes and no..... My local tech and sales guy have a good relationship with us and they know we know what the heck we are doing... If they are honest and good people they will absolutely tell you right out this is fine... If they are only out to sell you a bucket of paint at a time your using the wrong supplier.....We are several hundred gallons of materials a week so I guess that can be a different story for a guy with a bucket or two here and there...plus we are buying the reducers and solvents from them anyways.... just not their prepackaged blends....So if your not confident about how you mix coatings and what your putting in it...... ask them or buy the blends.

10/8/20       #21: Question.... ...
Leo G Member

Ya, that's a lot of paint. You get better service with that kind of buying power.

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