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Cracking Nightmares ....

2/16/23       
Scott Member

Website: http://www.bakerhesseldenz.com

Hi All,

I am kind of at my wits end with a finishing issue we are having. I've had the issue occassionally in the past, but not as bad as the last few months.
The finish is cracking really badly within the first few weeks of the piece being done. This only happens on veneered pieces ... never on solid wood. It seems like the veneer is shrinking slightly after the finish is applied, but it does not seem to matter how long I let the veneer acclimate, or how long I wait after veneering to finish the piece.

The particulars are ...

20mil paper backed veneer
applied with 3m water based contact cement
Substrate: Usually MDF
Finish: Varicure Pre Cat 10 sheen matt

My business is located in Tucson ... an extremely dry place. Currently 12% humidity and will top out at about 30% sometimes during the rainy season in Summer. The problem seems to be worse in winter when the humidity is super low.

Any thoughts?


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View higher quality, full size image (960 X 1280)

2/16/23       #2: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Dave Edgerton  Member

I hate to say it but the adhesive chosen is the culprit. You cannot repair what you have now unfortunately. Water base contact adhesive can only be used with phenolic backed veneer.
This paper backed veneer should have been done with a pva adhesive in a press or best yet with a urea resin adhesive. Sorry for the bad news.
2/16/23       #3: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Scott Member

Thanks Dave. I was fearing that that was the issue. For years we have been a 95% solid wood furniture company, but we recently started manufacturing a collection for another company. Their designs are mostly veneer. I am going to look into purchasing a veneer press today, and switch to a better veneer glue.

What type / brand would you suggest? What is going to be the best?

2/16/23       #4: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Tom Gardiner

Yup, Dave nailed it. I press with Type II pva. I use Richelieu's Liongrip brand but I haven't had problems with Helmitin, Titebond etc. A hot press is ideal for speed. A flip top vacuum press works fine if your volumes are low.

2/16/23       #5: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
RichC

I hate paper backed veneer. It means you have two layers of adhesive between the veneer and the substrate. The layer that holds the paper to the veneer and the layer that holds the paper to the substrate. Paperbacked doubles the trouble of laying veneer.

2/16/23       #6: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Dave Edgerton  Member

@ scott, you can go to veneersystems.com website and they have a whole shwack of glue types you can read up on. If you can use a 2 part plastic resin glue it has a long open time and exactly the glue you want for veneer. The folks at that business are very informed.
2/20/23       #8: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Scott Member

One more question ...

So I have ordered a vacuum press system and glue, so I think I am heading in the right direction.

My next question ... What is the best method for pressing down veneer on objects that will not fit in the vacuum bag? For instance, I need to re veneer the top of a coffee table. When I remove the legs, the top is 60" x 60" x 5", which will not fit in my new vacuum bag.

I have a file cabinet that needs the top redone as well.

2/21/23       #9: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Dave Edgerton  Member

Without a pic of the object its hard to formulate an answer

2/21/23       #10: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
Scott Member

Sorry for the lack of picture, but it is just a big 60" x 60" square table top. It is 5" thick, which means it wont fit in my vacuum bag. I can get the top out of storage to take a picture but that does not seem necessary.

2/21/23       #11: Cracking Nightmares .... ...
RichC

You can buy supplies to make your own custom bags.


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