Hey guys,

This is my first post but I’m a long time visitor. Thank you all for sharing your experiences and expertise with others.

The company I work for does mostly custom homes and remodels/bathrooms/kitchens. We do a limited amount of cabinet work but enough for us to want to upgrade our spray system.

I’ve got a salesman coming Wednesday to demo an Anest Iwata 17:1 AAA pump. He claims it is comparable to a Kremlin or Graco…just somewhat cheaper.

Hopefully the spec sheet for it uploads with this post.

Do any of y’all have experience to know whether this pump is worthwhile?

Thanks,
Roger

Click the link below to download the file included with this post.

Anest_Iwata_MSU32_17_1_pump_package.pdf

first off, how often do you spray and do you change colors or materials a lot?

sure it is an equal but, if you only have a one gun system, the pump is kinda oversized not really a bad thing unless you have to start changing colors and materials.

here is why, has big outlet filter that holds a lot of material that needs to be cleaned out, second the gun may be a little stiff as it has an small tip filter at the fluid inlet of the gun, also adds weight to gun and may be a little over kill for me.

a 17-1 ratio is right on target although you might depending on coatings be able to use the 13-1 pump. one thing i found interesting with iwata is how they rate the fluid delivery of their pumps," 0.93gal/min (3.5L/min)
Maximum Cycle 92cycles/min " if you ran a pump that hard you would need to super glue it to the floor, most every other spray eqpt company rates their pumps at 60 cycles a minute.

also they use bsp fittings on air and fluid so if you need a new airline to the gun you would really have to crank down hard if you only had a nps "a more universal fitting in the industry"

all in all, pumps last only as hard as they are run, the more cycles per gallon, = higher flow rates , means more up and down strokes for the displacement rod and packing.

to me sound like you only might need a 13-1 or like a 15-1 kremlin, binks, cat , wagner industrial or graco, all of which imho have more distribution here in the states and a larger customer base

hope this helps let me know if you have any questions

good luck,
herb j

Thanks for your detailed response.

Just to clarify a few things you said...

You said the pump is a bit overkill--are you referring to the pump ratio? The salesman recommended that ratio since we wanted to be able to spray coatings like SW Emerald Urethane as well as thinner cabinet coatings.

" has big outlet filter that holds a lot of material that needs to be cleaned out, second the gun may be a little stiff as it has an small tip filter at the fluid inlet of the gun, also adds weight to gun and may be a little over kill for me."

Is this something that Kremlin and Graco guns do not have? Would there be a small Graco or Kremlin that would be more suited for spraying one or two gallons at a time? What type of AAA would be most effective for spraying smaller amounts of finish?

i went ahead to the sw site and looked for their application guide, was not worth {worthless imho} much just the standard bs, seems to me they are more detailed on their industrial coatings than this one

Spray - Airless:-----my comments, would not recommend, old thinking
Pressure 2000 p.s.i.-------my comments, how about a range
Tip .013-.017 inch---------.17 tip at 2000psi, better have your roller skates on

HVLP System: Graco ® HVLP 9.5, number 3
or 4 needle and cap, two-thirds air pressure,
number 5 material setting. Single turbine, no
reduction.

but the important thing is if it can be sprayed with a turbine, imho, it can most likely be sprayed at aaa pressures well less 1000psi. my guess only will be 700psi hydraulic or approx 50psi on the pump regulator of a 15-1 ratio pump.

yes, units like graco, binks, cat, wagner, kremlin do not come standard with external 100 mesh or so fluid filter. they are built into the gun handle for easier maneuverability. but they do have a final filter so to speak as described above.

since you are only spraying 1-2 gallon at time, i would not go with the higher gpm unit. overkill, at 1-2 gallons at time, you would be fine with say a binks, graco, cat, wagner aa, kremlin with a lower delivery rate.

which brand to buy, first off, i would be looking at the company you are buying from, the units in terms of performance are all very close in terms of ratio and gpm delivery but does the person selling you the unit, really know the unit and understand how to set it up correctly and troubleshoot it?? do they stock parts or do you have to pay extra for drop shipped parts from the factory? in other words are they paint supply house or finishing distributor. some can do both well, most can't imho

i would take the money you save by getting the smaller pump and get a little larger of a range of tips, for example, .11., .13, ...15 in various widths based upon your knowledge of what you typically spray. keep the tips wet after use. also get some spare gun handle filters and white tip seals. also look to see if you can get some w/b cleaner like acrastrip or a similiar competitor. makes clean up much much easier, never in my days did i think a w/b would be effective but my thinking was quite dated. w/b high quality cleaner similiar to or equal to acrastrip really friggin work.......i am an old mek guy :-}

also before any haters come on and blast me for not liking iwata products, just the opposite. i am talking about the size of the pump not the quality of product.

So something like a Merkur 15:1 might be an easier gun to handle?

just look at any of these guns , ca tech bobcat, binks aa, wagner, 4100, graco, all have internal filters

also i forgot to mention one thing, be sure to get a high atomizing spray tip, referred to by many different names, sometimes called a pre atomizing tip, or fine finish tip, what it does , is disturbs or disrupts the laminar fluid before it reaches the tip. for a w/b i would certainly suggest it. also get a demo from another mfg to compare. or two. then have them give best price. just don't settle one on brand before a demo. if they aren't willing to do a demo, see ya, etc. you will be spending probably around 2k plus.. you are the customer, see the guns , test the guns for that kind of money, you will also get to see the salesmen knowledge and he will most likely be your point of contact going forward after you make a purchase decision.

good luck
herb j

goodlu

roger what did you finally decide upon?

Well, the salesman and the Anest Iwata rep came and did a demoed a 17:1 unit for us. Both guys, but especially the rep were very knowledgeable. The pump sprayed everything we tried excellently. We sprayed some Zinsser 123 primer with it and it laid it down beautifully, as well as spraying nice coats of lacquer. We even ran it some on a small pancake compressor.

The external filter you mentioned as a downside is optional and mostly used in multi gun setups I understood him to say. The gun comes standard with a filter in the handle.

I asked about the NPT and BSP fittings. The rep said that all the air fittings are NPT. The BSP fittings are strictly for the fluid side of things...so that people don't try to use air fittings on them.

All in all, my two bosses were there and were impressed. My boss is cutting them a check today for a unit. We're hoping it will dramatically speed up our shop spraying and that it will allow us to spray more on jobsites with less of a mess than airless.

The gun comes standard with a 513 tip. We're going to try it out and see if that works for most of our needs.

Thanks Herb for all the suggestions. They definitely helped me ask the Rep better questions. Hopefully the new unit makes itself worthwhile.

thx roger for the update, also the 513 is a pretty wide tip, i would try and "work them a little" bit for like a 411 and 413 sizes. always glad to help, i love spray eqpt questions, you will see a DRAMATIC difference in overspray btw, i am guess you need about a very stout 3hp to run the machine, probably like at least 10-12 cfm i would ask you rep specifically what cfm not so much pressure it takes to run the gun and the pump. almost any compressor can make 60psi but it is the volume output or cfm that will make the difference on a successful jobsite.....be sure to determine that.....good luck i would also recommend getting some tip seals, gun handle filters, and cleaning needles for the tips.....many of that that stuff you can find good deals on ebay, i have. also ask for the smallest id, siphon hose you can id and length, you are not pumping roof cement, usually most companies oversize them too much and thus takes a lot more thinner to clean out