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Mitered corners on solid table

12/3/20       
Nick Cook Member

Website: http://kootenaicabinets.com

I have a customer that sends me pictures of tables that appear to be solid wood. They have edge glued field area with solid wood wrapped around the whole table with mitered corners. I told her the mitered corners will crack. She doesn't believe me. Or is there a joinery method I don't understand? The corners she wants and the pictures appear to have very tight mitered seams.

12/3/20       #2: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Tom Gardiner

My first thought is how does she know it is solid wood? You could offer random matched veneer and no one would be the wiser

12/4/20       #3: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Nick Cook Member

Website: http://kootenaicabinets.com

I'm just curious if a solid wood wrapped table with mitered corners is good practice in furniture making, I've been in woodworking now for 29 years and this design slipped by me as a good design when it comes to seasonal wood movement. But I thought maybe I'd learn some new trick in woodworking. Am I wrong? I told the customer it's a bad design and I would not guarantee the tightness of the corners. She's second guessing me and showing me pictures of antique and current tables with this design.

12/4/20       #4: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Rocket

The customer has absolutely no clue what they're talking about. Zero. I can build a solid wood table with a miter border right now then take a picture showing tight joints...then the seasons happen. Sounds like the type of client I would add a PITA surcharge to any work and document EVERYTHING in writing, which is good practice regardless.

12/4/20       #5: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Nick Cook Member

Website: http://kootenaicabinets.com

Thank you, I didn't think I was going crazy or missing some new (after 6000 years of woodworking history) technique.

12/4/20       #6: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Jack Mazzuchelli  Member

Consider lock miter joints, pia but when done well they dont come apart. Basically a tongue and groove miter joint

12/4/20       #7: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Nick Cook Member

Website: http://kootenaicabinets.com

Jack,

A tongue and groove miter joint. I've refurbished these kinds of joints on wood boat windshield frames. I don't believe they can stand up to the expansion and contraction of a Quarter Sawn white oak edge glued panels that's about 16 to 18 inches wide.

12/4/20       #8: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Dave Sochar Member

If she can offer you some antique samples - examine them closely. If there are any - and a that is a great big if - then they exist by luck or exception. Not by common construction. Often the table was quartered lumber and used as a boards, with the mitered rim added later, after the table had found its equilibrium. We do not have that luxury.

Secondly, you will not see that design in antiques for one good reason - they cannot build them that way.

Remember the two Rules: 1.Solid wood will move. 2. Woodworkers will forever disagree on when, where, how much and why.

My bet is the a the table field is veneered, and the rim is also veneered. We tend to forget that any manufacturer must have two things: ease of construction, and predictability in manufacturing. Solid wood gives most manufacturers fits precisely because it does move. They will avoid it for all the reasons we would use it. They will be attracted to all veneered parts since they are predictable - or, more predictable than solid. Cores of MDF or particle board will hold a miter as well as the veneers. Sizes of components will be consistent and call backs will drop to zero.

12/4/20       #9: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Glen Harwell

Typical of a veneered top with solid edge detail. We do them all the time. You wrap a solid top with a solid edge and it will crack, period.

12/4/20       #10: Mitered corners on solid table ...
duster

I've done a lot of these type of table tops. The only way I'll do it is with a veneer center panel, then wrap it with a mitered solid wood border. I learned the hard way long ago that wrapping a solid wood top is just a disaster waiting for seasonal wood movement to occur. Either the miters will open or the panel will crack.

The tables shown were built this way with alder and oak, and have held up for years with no issues.


View higher quality, full size image (800 X 417)


View higher quality, full size image (608 X 336)

12/4/20       #11: Mitered corners on solid table ...
duster

Here are couple more in walnut and oak with the same construction method. As the others here have stated, it's the best way to achieve a long term good result.

12/4/20       #12: Mitered corners on solid table ...
duster

Here's the walnut one.

12/4/20       #13: Mitered corners on solid table ...
duster

Hmm.. the walnut photo won't load...

12/4/20       #14: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Mark B Member

Just tell her you'll gladly build to her specifications and take her money along with a signed contract that she specified the construction method and takes all responsibility for any future defect.

As awful as that concept is, rather than us makers having to reason, debate, argue, edu-ma-cate, or worse, walk away from a paying job, the misery foisted on us by the Pinterest/HGTV mob may just have to learn their lessons the hard way if they so choose.

If after a brief explanation she still balk's/argues, just ask her to put in writing how she specifies the table to be constructed and let her sign the contract.

12/4/20       #15: Mitered corners on solid table ...
rich c

You might get away with if if the center of the table is very strictly quarter sawn, and the miter frame around the outside is narrow. The major seasonal change direction with true quarter sawn is vertical. Get to rift sawn and you will start to get a little width movement too. A low movement species will also help.

12/5/20       #16: Mitered corners on solid table ...
D Brown

Even though we know it is not the best way to go, you could think of it as more of a floating center panel in a groove with a deliberate notch or type of vee groove around the edge to hide any movement.
It would be like a 4 sided breadboard end. good luck.

12/19/20       #17: Mitered corners on solid table ...
Matt Calnen

Can you provide pictures of what she wants? I have made several tables with an applied wood molding mitered around a solid wood top. As D Brown said, there are ways to put the wood in a groove or channel that allow for movement.


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