Message Thread:
Need reliable source for hardware
2/3/21
As a vital part of my grandiose plan I need to incorporate drawer box production in my shop based on a metal box drawer systems, like Blum Metabox or Grass Zargen/Integra or whatever else in similar price and quality range.
However, I have - or at least I think I have - some problems finding reliable source of those. I've spend whole week shopping around, but without much success.
Some retailers carry some of those in their brick & mortar shops that are in another city but for some reason!? not in shops in my area.
Some online shops seem to have those in abundance but shipping costs are ridiculous (like $200 for shipping for a $400 of merchandise).
Other that have reasonable shipping costs have just a few on stock, and need to contact whomever to find out if and when the amount I need will be available.
Then some seem to have enough items on stock and reasonable costs of shipping, but the prices of items is two- or threefold of what others ask.
Employees I can reach over the phone, or in person in case of local shops, mostly have no clue about anything.
Is this how it usually is? Am I expecting too much?
I'm not sure if this forum's marketing policies allow to openly suggest places to shop for goods and services, but if not please, if you have any suggestions, send them to me in private message, if it's not allowed here.
Thank you,
O.
2/3/21 #2: Need reliable source for hardware ...
I don't know your situation.
I briefly tried a couple of drawer box systems with same results
I got pushback on the Zargens, which frankly are kind of low end feeling and I tried the Legrabox.
In my area the wood dovetail box is the benchmark.
Neither stocked enough inventory and I can offer 1/2" Baltic birch sides for builder to mid grade and hardwood in any number of species to the higher end...with either sitting on Blum Tandem slides for the same or less money than the Zargen, Metabox or Legrabox.
I don't have to stock endless heights, lengths, rails, press fittings or boring and pressing machines...or wait for backordered inventory.
Most customers accept the dovetailed Baltic birch without question.
The higher end customers want the drawer boxes to match the cabinet- maple, white oak, sapele, african mahogany, walnut, ect.
I machined them on a manual Brookman for years (for sale btw) and my volume finally requires a Dodds SE20 automatic.
PM for more info.
2/3/21 #4: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Oggie,
Not sure of your location.
We use HDL out of Minnesota, they carry a full line of Legrabox hardware, its a bit tricky ordering all the components, but my Blum rep says they will be offering drawer kits coming this year.
2/4/21 #5: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Talk with your Häfele rep. We have metal box systems from Grass, Salice and several of our own products including the Matrix family.
2/4/21 #6: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Thank you all for your inputs.
Sean,
I've applied to HDL for opening an account today, hope they'll respond soon.
Scott,
I tried to open an account on Häfele website even before I posted the question here, but was unable to reach a page where one could register for an account.
I left a message regarding that problem, but nobody reached back to me as of today. That was one of many reasons I came here to complain :)
In the meantime I tried to open registration page this evening again, and this time it worked :)
I filled in the data just now and I'm waiting confirmation email.
Jim,
my customers are 95% rental management companies that take care of rental properties that are not exactly high end. The only two things they care about is price and speed. Although my cabinets are strong enough as any other, the installation needs to be fast and functional, not beautiful. The average length of cabinet/kitchen life in such environment is only a few years, due to renter's negligence, cleaning crews that soak everything in whatever chemistry they use for cleaning between two renters, painting companies that overspray everything, pest control that sprays everything, roof leaks and water pipe bursts that flood everything and occasional axe(?!) damages or some people using countertops as a chopping board and so on.
Even before old renter moves out, they already rent the unit for the next one. Usually time between old one moving out and new one moving in is less than two weeks, sometimes just a week. In that time frame drywall, painting, flooring, cleaning and many other repairs need to be done, as well as complete kitchen or at least some cabinets (if not complete kitchen than usually base cabinets and the wall cabinet above the rangehood).
They do not examine the situation till the old tenant moves out, so that leaves just a week or two to finish all those works, and usually just a day or two for kitchen installation, which has to be synchronized with all other vendors and their parts. And then I have to fabricate everything before the installation.
Cabinets need to be easily replaceable as a separate units, as well as drawers and doors. Since nobody really cares how drawers look or how they are made (just how fast and how cheap they can get them) I want to make life easier for myself. That's why metal boxes. Besides that, I myself really don't find anything wrong with them, in my kitchen or any other whatsoever. I know some people have stronger opinions on that, especially cabinet fabricators, but I don't.
However, if I could find any cheaper and faster way of doing it I would have no problems with it either.
2/4/21 #7: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Oggie, I’m really sorry to hear that you’ve hit so many dead-ends. I’m the corporate trainer and it’s been over 20 years since I was a customer, so I don’t have the latest intel on how to register online. I highly recommend calling our customer service department at 1(800)Hafele1 and thank you for your repeated attempts to conduct business with us. Scott
2/5/21 #8: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Not sure on the supply down there. But up here in Canada with the covid situation there is not too many sitting on stock. Some won't even be taking new customers as they are having a hard time filling orders as it is.
Construction is booming here. We've had two record months in a row. Hoping it levels out very soon.
2/6/21 #9: Need reliable source for hardware ...
We use legrabox and order through our Richelieu account for metal drawer boxes (which we don't do that often).
As others commented, there are a lot of parts and sizing options to order, however they seem to be in stock and arrive very quickly. They are a bit pricey and there's some labor involved with notching the bottoms as you are probably aware of.
2/9/21 #10: Need reliable source for hardware ...
I've opened an account with Hafele and I had one with Richelieu from before.
However, when I called my local Richelieu store on the phone to ask if they have in store some of the items I found on their website they told me they don't carry those items here in US, only in Canada. They never bother to mention that I can still order them and have them delivered here!?
Anyway, it looks like they deliver very fast (for example 2 days for Blum Metabox and 4 days for wood dowels) and the shipping costs are reasonable and even free if order exceeds certain amount.
Hafele also seems to have reasonable shipping costs, but somewhat limited choice of drawer box systems which are mostly sold in bulks.
Thank you all for your help.
I'll try Richelieu first and see how it goes.
2/10/21 #11: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Oggie,
I'm glad that you were able to get set-up with us. Just curious, were you told that your choice of metal drawer box was only sold in bulk? I ask because there was a time when pretty much everything we sold was only available in master cartons, but for many years now we break almost all of our SPQs. One thing that confuses some folks is that we still show the SPQ in our catalog so that if someone wants to order a complete master carton, they can. Unless the item is non-stock for some reason (Unpopular finish, size, prone to damage, etc.) most of our items are available to order by the piece, pair or set.
My assumption is that it's a throwback to the days when we only sold through distribution. That ended at least 25 years ago. I remember because that's what I was a customer and joined the old "Plant Manager" program, which was Häfele America's first push to sell direct to the shop. If no one has talked to you about it you need to inquire about our "MyHäfele" program, which is the current loyalty program. Better pricing, lower freight threshold and additional benefits. Scott
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2/12/21 #12: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Scott,
thank you very much for the additional explanations.
I must confess that I was not very thorough at examining all the details, I just looked for the parts I needed and found that they are sold in bulks of 5, 10 or more or something like that (maybe I just somehow missed 1 pc. option).
Anyway, even if so, those are not some large quantity increments to cause any concern.
I will look at it again in more detail and will certainly check those options you recommended.
All the best,
O.
3/1/21 #13: Need reliable source for hardware ...
Häfele has the grass Zargen slides. They are available in bulk pallet loads and in standard Grass box quantity of 5 each. If you still need help pm me and I will send you contact info for grass rep who can hook you up.
If you commit to certain quantities, grass and Hafele will team up and give you a great deal on boring machine and assembly press for these drawers.
We are in the process of going back to Zargen drawers after about 9 years of doing side mounts. Of all the metal sided drawers they are the simplest set up and easiest to assemble
2/21/22 #14: Need reliable source for hardware ...
They do not examine the situation till the old tenant moves out, so that leaves just a week or two to finish all those works, and usually just a day or two for kitchen installation, which has to be synchronized with all other vendors and their parts.
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